Chadwick Street / Trinity Street Development Announced

[simonesaffron]

Fair enough Wheels.

[wheels]

Rest assured Dave I am not "chums" with any elected member. Just an aware observer who comes to a different conclusion to you and it seems to makes you suspicious that anyone can think differently to you.

[Dave]

Don't worry Dave I am not in any way a party member.

An interesting denial, of something that was never suggested!   Party membership is not the issue - being chums with one or more senior Libdem councillors is what we're talking about.   

anyone at all could have come to the same conclusion.

'Anyone at all' could not have heard 'group members laughing out loud'! 

[wheels]

Like Dave, not for the first time have I wondered the same. Of course Wheels you can be affiliated in any way with anybody you wish, it is entirely up to you. It is just that an honest perspective is always appreciated and if their are vested interests then that perspective is often compromised.

For my part my comments on this issue whether steeped in reality or not have no political, party bias in any way, they are just my comments as I see them. I expect and welcome disagreement it is part of the fun. Exactly which group members do you refer to? Please for once elaborate on your assertions.

As for political parties in general...a plague on all their houses.   

Just to be clear Simone my comments are just bases on those of an aware observer not as a supporter or member and anyone at all could have come to the same conclusion.

[wheels]

I find myself wondering - not for the first time - whether wheels has any connection with the Libdem group on Stockport Council.  Perhaps a declaration of interests would be in order, wheels? 

Don't worry Dave I am not in any way a party member. In fact I am sat in the office at the moment reading the Morning Star

[Dave]

Wheels' silence is quite eloquent, and in the absence of any denial we can take it that he has some connection with the Libdem group on the council.    Although judging from these posts from a few weeks ago, not with any of the six Marple councillors! 

I believe our authority is in good hands under the leadership of Cllr Derbyshire ......... I do accept therr are some extremly weak and illliberal  members in Marple.

I think the Marple ward councillors in this whole situation are largely irrelevant they are not part of the decision making process or of any wider strategic thinking. Thus I have much more confidence than you Dave. I would have concerns if the Marple six mattered at all.

I urge you to have confidence in the Coucnil leadership Dave.

So wheels' Libdem connection is likely to be with one or more other councillors, and probably senior ones.  Nothing wrong with that, of course - but it's the kind of connection which is best declared openly rather than kept under wraps! 

[simonesaffron]

Like Dave, not for the first time have I wondered the same. Of course Wheels you can be affiliated in any way with anybody you wish, it is entirely up to you. It is just that an honest perspective is always appreciated and if their are vested interests then that perspective is often compromised.

For my part my comments on this issue whether steeped in reality or not have no political, party bias in any way, they are just my comments as I see them. I expect and welcome disagreement it is part of the fun. Exactly which group members do you refer to? Please for once elaborate on your assertions.

As for political parties in general...a plague on all their houses.   

[Dave]

I find myself wondering - not for the first time - whether wheels has any connection with the Libdem group on Stockport Council.  Perhaps a declaration of interests would be in order, wheels? 

[wheels]

Alstan,

There is of course much validity in what you say and I certainly hope that my "critique" did not seem to suggest otherwise, but the Lib Dem Constituency Association would not itself even claim to speak for all Lib Dems on all issues. Naturally they will grab a headline as they did in your example but they will of course dissect it at a later date if it suits.

Given the current information, I personally cannot see how the traffic generated in the Trinity Street scheme is not going to be much worse for the people of Marple than the traffic generated by ASDA and unless our MP is a bit thick (and if he's reading this and even if he isn't, I DON'T THINK HE IS- thick, I mean, ) then he must see the same. Nevertheless, I think that his comments were made when the view was still held that it was the Hibbert Lane Supermarket or the status quo and naturally as you would expect an MP to do he was playing to the gallery at the time.

Wheels, Stunnell's view is not irrelevant. He may not have a seat on the various committees but he is the Lib Dem MP in Lib Dem ruled Marple, in Lib Dem ruled Stockport. He is decidedly not without influence. He will know what the blow- by- blow situation is with both these planning applications as they are happening, long before you and I will. He will know anybody worth knowing that plays any part in that decision both locally and probably nationally. Marple is the Lib Dem jewel in the crown for the party. The MP and Marple 6 are close to each other. Three of the Marple 6 are on THE Council Executive and one of them is vice - chair of planning. They are a party within a party and they influence happenings in Marple, not always openly, in fact often in a covert way but they do. When you say that they have no influence - with respect you are just ...wishfully thinking...

Ponder on this, if there had been no Marple 6 and no Andrew Stunnell, there would have been no Trinity Street/ Kirkland development and the C&MSFC/ASDA would now be well on its way to sailing through. This you cannot deny.

Here is something else to ponder upon. Does anybody know what would be the overall  implications of Kirkland reducing the size of its proposed store ( not the car park, just sales and backup) by say 25% ?                 

You really are out of touch with reality if you believe any of that Simone. Group members reading your comments have laughted out loud.

[amazon]

To answer JMC's question ('I personally don't understand why they are so against it'), I've always assumed that they came out against the Hibbert Lane scheme when they were shouted at by a hysterical crowd in the Memorial Park in July last year, and they can't change their views for fear of losing face.

Already said that Dave .i still don't think there's that many against it .people that I've asked in marple
Most would like a supermarket at the ridge ,would save them having to go out of marple to supermarket shop
Mia says it would close the shops . If that's so why is there quite a number of shops already closed . Could it be large business rates . The coop is deadly for prices .

[Dave]

To answer JMC's question ('I personally don't understand why they are so against it'), I've always assumed that they came out against the Hibbert Lane scheme when they were shouted at by a hysterical crowd in the Memorial Park in July last year, and they can't change their views for fear of losing face.

[wheels]

Alstan,

There is of course much validity in what you say and I certainly hope that my "critique" did not seem to suggest otherwise, but the Lib Dem Constituency Association would not itself even claim to speak for all Lib Dems on all issues. Naturally they will grab a headline as they did in your example but they will of course dissect it at a later date if it suits.

Given the current information, I personally cannot see how the traffic generated in the Trinity Street scheme is not going to be much worse for the people of Marple than the traffic generated by ASDA and unless our MP is a bit thick (and if he's reading this and even if he isn't, I DON'T THINK HE IS- thick, I mean, ) then he must see the same. Nevertheless, I think that his comments were made when the view was still held that it was the Hibbert Lane Supermarket or the status quo and naturally as you would expect an MP to do he was playing to the gallery at the time.

Wheels, Stunnell's view is not irrelevant. He may not have a seat on the various committees but he is the Lib Dem MP in Lib Dem ruled Marple, in Lib Dem ruled Stockport. He is decidedly not without influence. He will know what the blow- by- blow situation is with both these planning applications as they are happening, long before you and I will. He will know anybody worth knowing that plays any part in that decision both locally and probably nationally. Marple is the Lib Dem jewel in the crown for the party. The MP and Marple 6 are close to each other. Three of the Marple 6 are on THE Council Executive and one of them is vice - chair of planning. They are a party within a party and they influence happenings in Marple, not always openly, in fact often in a covert way but they do. When you say that they have no influence - with respect you are just ...wishfully thinking...

Ponder on this, if there had been no Marple 6 and no Andrew Stunnell, there would have been no Trinity Street/ Kirkland development and the C&MSFC/ASDA would now be well on its way to sailing through. This you cannot deny.

Here is something else to ponder upon. Does anybody know what would be the overall  implications of Kirkland reducing the size of its proposed store ( not the car park, just sales and backup) by say 25% ?                 

Lets revisit this after the Group AGM in May.

[amazon]

Will local Counccillors have overlooked this possibility as by all accounts they now seem hell - bent on defeating C&MSFC/ASDA at all costs?      

I personally don't understand why they are so against it.

Because some of them don't want to go back on there word .

[JMC]

Will local Counccillors have overlooked this possibility as by all accounts they now seem hell - bent on defeating C&MSFC/ASDA at all costs?      

I personally don't understand why they are so against it.

[simonesaffron]

Here is something else to ponder upon. Does anybody know what would be the overall  implications of Kirkland reducing the size of its proposed store ( not the car park, just sales and backup) by say 25% ?                  

Pure speculation (but hey, that's what we all deal in here!): if the sales area went down to, say, 17,000 sq.ft (similar to the Co-op, I think?), that could strengthen the camsfc/Asda case, because the Kirkland scheme would no longer be a full-size supermarket.  

Dave, as you say "pure speculation". What is the definition of a  "full size supermarket"?

Conversely, could it strengthen the Trinity Street case. I.E. less sales area, less customers needed, less traffic caused, car park now adequate, scheme now more viable, particularly to retailers who build smaller supermarkets?

Will local Counccillors have overlooked this possibility as by all accounts they now seem hell - bent on defeating C&MSFC/ASDA at all costs?