A Grand Tour of the Political Parties

[Duke Fame]

Does this really sound like the observations of a member of the Labour Party?

It sounds like a chap who as a member of the Labour party has taken the time to reflect on their record and listened to the wonderfully compelling case put forward by the Duke of Fame and realised I'm right ;-)

[Bowden Guy]

But doesn't this happen all the time haven't Labour and their friends tried to convince us that Tution Fees came out of the Coalition when in fact they (Labour) introduced them and the coalition considerably improved the system. Were not Labour first to introduce the Bedroom Tax which they operated via the Housing Benefit system while they now pretend their hands are clean. Was it not Labour that introduced rail fare iincreases plus a % the list goes on of things they pretend had nothing to do with them. Was it not Labour who first introduced the market into the NHS.

I have to say Dave I am with Duke on this the last Labour Govt was just about the most shambolic I can recall in a lifetime which broadly covers the same time period as yours.

Does this really sound like the observations of a member of the Labour Party?

[sgk]

Have a look at the You Tube clip
? TTIP: Regulatory Cooperation - a Threat to Democracy - YouTube
parliamentary candidates at the forthcoming election.

[marplerambler]

Ever heard of TTIP (Transatlantic Trade and Investment Partnership)?  I must admit that I had not until today but it appears to be a new treaty clothed in secrecy but supported by David Cameron which I have been informed by a left-wing friend could lead to multi-national corporations  suing the country if any sections of the NHS currently operated by private companies for the NHS were to be re-integrated into a government controlled NHS, it is a treaty which will lead to abolition of food labeling regulations in order to make it easier for multinational corporations to undercut the prices of products which currently have to comply with British Health & Safety regulations.
Representatives of Greenpeace and other groups protested against TTIP in Brussels over the weekend stating that it will be a undermining of existing British legislation by international Big Business which is being kept from the electorate prior to the election.
Have a look at the You Tube clip
? TTIP: Regulatory Cooperation - a Threat to Democracy - YouTube

This really gives me the creeps! It may well be the claims of a covert attempt to keep it out of the news prior to the election is just scaremongering from the far Left but if there is any truth in the allegations this should be on the agenda of the local parliamentary candidates at the forthcoming election.

[Duke Fame]

Best not to feed the troll, tigerman.

As Dave is aware, he's lost the argument when he resorts to petty name calling.

[tonysheldon]

 

[Dave]

Best not to feed the troll, tigerman. 

[tonysheldon]

The bail-out may or may not have been the answer, maybe the central bankers should have let them hang, only history will judge, but people are starting to wake up to the fact that the ordinary man on the street didnt benefit from the vast pile of money thrown at the banks. It saved the bankers from giving up their Maseratis, but many commentators are suggesting that we are heading the same way again.

[Duke Fame]

This is getting nowhere, predictably enough!  I'll recap, if only for Duke's sake: I challenged him to find a reputable economist who opposed the 2008 bank bailout, writing:
That article is about austerity, which is an entirely different matter.  There is not a single word about the bailout in it.  Honestly Duke, I'd give up if I were you!   

i don;t want to sound condescending (that means talking down to people) Dave, but if you think that article is about austerity, I think you may not quite have the best understanding of economics (mind, you are a lefty, few of them have).

Nevertheless, you misunderstand my point, it's not that Brown was wrong to bail-out the banks, simply that he was hardly the only one who thought it the solution and moreover, Brown wasn't the chancellor at the time either.

The bail-out was not without it's critics, Stiglitz was pretty much ahead of the game in suggesting a bail-out but has been fiercely critical of it's execution.

[Dave]

Oh well, if the Beeb says it then it must be true!   

But it's not in his famous and possibly history-changing speech last September:http://www.cityam.com/1411051570/gordon-browns-better-together-speech-eve-scottish-independence-referendum-vote-full-video

......  so when did he say it? 

Incidentally, it's worth watching a bit of that, if only to admire the rhetorical style of his delivery, the effective speaking from memory (think Ed Miliband!), and the unashamed appeal to the emotions.  Most politicians don't speak like that nowadays - it's a world away from Barack Obama, or David Cameron, both of whom I regard as excellent speakers, but times and styles have changed so much. 

[Bowden Guy]

Well, Dave, might I please refer to a report from your beloved BBC which states, quite categorically, that the pledge to retain the Barnett Formula was first announced by Gordon Brown.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-29213418

You might want to scroll down to paragraph 25......,,

Fact -  Gordon Brown is still a very popular figure in Scotland and it was presumably decided  (by the Tories, Labour and Lib Dems) that he was the best person to present this commitment to the (wavering) Scottish electorate.

[Dave]

OK, I think I get it: Cameron, Clegg and Miliband promised the Scots that the Barnett Formula would continue.  So Gordon Brown is responsible for that? BG, your arguments are getting almost as flimsy as Duke's. 

[Bowden Guy]

This promise, Dave. It's from The Guardian, so its claim that there was a promise to retain the Barnett Formula indefinitely,p must be true......

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/sep/16/politicians-scottish-funding-pledge-anger-daily-record

[Dave]

This is getting nowhere, predictably enough!  I'll recap, if only for Duke's sake: I challenged him to find a reputable economist who opposed the 2008 bank bailout, writing:

perhaps Duke can refer us to another equally distinguished economist who agrees with him?

That article is about austerity, which is an entirely different matter.  There is not a single word about the bailout in it.  Honestly Duke, I'd give up if I were you!   

[Duke Fame]

I can't find it - could you post it again?

http://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/134863/raghuram-g-rajan/the-true-lessons-of-the-recession