EU Referendum

[andrewbowden]

So this is what our esteemed MP gets up to when he thinks we aren't looking......   

https://www.scribd.com/document/371977491/Letter-from-European-Research-Group-to-PM-May#fullscreen&from_embed

That and taking part in survey panels. Don't know how he finds the time...
https://www.theyworkforyou.com/mp/25360/william_wragg/hazel_grove#register

[Dave]

So this is what our esteemed MP gets up to when he thinks we aren't looking......   

https://www.scribd.com/document/371977491/Letter-from-European-Research-Group-to-PM-May#fullscreen&from_embed

[simonesaffron]

Really, Amazing!

Suggests to me that if you can neither understand/follow the rules for your own election process, then you are either dishonest or incompetent. 

Either way the implications are concerning.   

[Condate]

It seems one thing after another. Today we here of The Conservatives fraudulent expenses submission during the General Election

To be fair, as well as the Conservatives http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-39289195  We have the Labour Party fined £20000 [http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-37760562 and the Lib Dems fined £20000 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-38234883, although the Conservative's fine is bigger at £70000. 

This does suggest to me that the rules are overcomplicated, if all three big parties got it wrong.

[simonesaffron]

Yes, I agree Dave, the conduct of current parliamentarians (all colours) does nothing to inspire anything positive.

On the EU issue Many MP's seem to have completely forgotten which way their constituents voted. Their loyalty to their political parties seems to far exceed any regard for the wishes of the people who put them in office in the first place.

It seems one thing after another. Today we here of The Conservatives fraudulent expenses submission during the General Election and also that we've got to pass a law to prevent MP's employing family members because they can't be trusted to comply on their own.

If there was an election tomorrow I wouldn't know who to vote for and that's the first time in my life, I've ever thought that.

[simonesaffron]

'An Italian tank,' Mikes.

Obviously your a Brexiteer.

[mikes]

...
Incredible!   Thank God for Nicola Sturgeon!   

She seems to be backtracking faster than an Italian tank as well.

[Dave]

a flock of sheep.   

No, sheep are much more sensible. Lemmings maybe, or perhaps jellyfish would be more apt, as the many Tory MPs who are remainers seem to have become completely spineless. And the way the Labour Party has caved in is beyond pathetic.

And how about this:  http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-latest-news-david-davis-no-economic-impact-assess-uk-eu-leave-no-deal-select-committee-a7630626.html

Incredible!   Thank God for Nicola Sturgeon!   

[simonesaffron]

Sensible, maybe, perhaps, time will tell. Could just as easily be catastrophic.

Anyway whether it's one or the other, definitely a flock of sheep.   

[Condate]

The Conservative Party in Parliament?

329 of em and 328 voted to trigger article 50.

Is that a challenging, questioning political group or a flock of sheep?

Perhaps a group of very sensible people (on this issue anyway).

[Hoffnung]

The Conservative Party in Parliament?

329 of em and 328 voted to trigger article 50.

Is that a challenging, questioning political group or a flock of sheep? 

[Cyberman]

Professor Michael Dougan of Liverpool University has uploaded a new video analysing our position and the Leave campaigns claims post-referendum:

[Dave]

It's beginning to look as though the Tory leadership election might be fought on two alternative ways forward to Brexit:  stay in the single market and accept continuing EU immigration (May), or curtail EU immigration by staying out of the single market (Leadsom)

[CllrGeoffAbell]

Interesting.  But fundamentally we Remainers did not make the case for the Heart as well as the Head.  Gove said during the Scottish referendum that he could be Scottish and British at the same time; there's no fundamental conflict.  We should have said that of being British and European.

What we seem to have from some leading Leavers is allowing free movement as the cost of no trade barriers.

It's EU-lite.  You've heard it here first!

[marpleexile]

1.  There's no correlation between leave voters and those who have come off worst as a result of post 2010 austerity.  So the Leave vote is not a protest against the Tory government.

I think that article makes one fundamental mistake, voters don't necessarily vote on what has actually happened to them, they vote on what they perceive has happened to them.

Councils across the land have been using "austerity" as an excuse for pretty much every cut in funding they had made since 2010, so whilst technically an area might not be worse off, the council has closed the local library and swimming pool in the name of austerity (when it was actually, say, a mis-management issue, or whatever) and so they think they are worse off.