Closure of Rose Hill School on Polling Day [12 December 2019]

[andrewbowden]

Nothing new - they've been closing schools on polling day in Marple forever. When I was a little girl we used to look forward to polling day. Sadly, by the time I was a teacher (not in Marple) the powers that be didn't close secondary schools.

My primary school was also a polling station.  And yes, it was great.  Less for my parents.  And even worse for those schools that still have to shut, who will now have closed three times in one year.

[My login is Henrietta]

Nothing new - they've been closing schools on polling day in Marple forever. When I was a little girl we used to look forward to polling day. Sadly, by the time I was a teacher (not in Marple) the powers that be didn't close secondary schools.

Seriously though, why can't "they" put the voting caravan on the school car park. That's what happens on Buxton Lane (and it used to happen when the college was on Hibbert Lane).

[Will L]

Lets remember it is the Labour and the Liberal Democrats that (being in control of the council) have decided that the education of chidden is of so little importance that they are not willing to use a tent (for example) in the car park instead of closing the school.   
I know that it is the “Counting Officer” not the Labour and the Liberal Democrats that legally decides, but the councillor clearly don’t care enough to use their powers as the “Counting Officer” employer.

If need be tempory fences like used on building sites could be used to separate the children from the public.

I suspect the officers would politely listen to the Councillors and then dutifully ignore them.

[wheels]

The Labour Party and the Liberal Democrats have an equal number of councillors on Stockport Council but it is the Labour Party who run the administration.

The Tories of course are no where in terms of elected councillors just 8 if I remember correctly.

[ringi]

Lets remember it is the Labour and the Liberal Democrats that (being in control of the council) have decided that the education of chidden is of so little importance that they are not willing to use a tent (for example) in the car park instead of closing the school.   
I know that it is the “Counting Officer” not the Labour and the Liberal Democrats that legally decides, but the councillor clearly don’t care enough to use their powers as the “Counting Officer” employer.

If need be tempory fences like used on building sites could be used to separate the children from the public.

[andrewbowden]

Safeguarding will be the excuse (it always is if 'elf 'n' safety or "data protection" can't be used), but from the info on the referendum that was published in this thread, I would guess that the actual reason is that any change to the normal room has to be approved, and that bureaucracy said "No!"

I doubt that's the case at all.  And like I said, there are severe problems with using any than a very small number rooms.  Equally I see no reason for the school to give a fake excuse to cover up for bureaucracy.  They have no incentive to do so, and arguably every excuse to call it out as doing so could change the situation.

It's a rather tired, pointless view to blame bureau for everything

And whilst some people may be comfortable with thousands of voters wandering around the school grounds in areas where, I am not.  Not so much from a stranger danger level, but from the disruption it would cause the pupils.

The ultimate solution to this is to do voting at weekend like many democracies.  But that will never happen because we as a nation can't possibly do what other countries do.  We are too arrogant to change anything.  It's simply not British.

[marpleexile]

I am guessing the issue with using a classroom is safeguarding.  They can isolate the hall from the pupils quite easily.  Classrooms wouldn't be easy to do so.  Maybe they could do the nursery area but have no idea if the layout of that room would work.

Safeguarding will be the excuse (it always is if 'elf 'n' safety or "data protection" can't be used), but from the info on the referendum that was published in this thread, I would guess that the actual reason is that any change to the normal room has to be approved, and that bureaucracy said "No!"

[andrewbowden]

Will also say I feel for the staff trying to organise this election.  It's all been done at the last minute at a time of year when room availability is especially difficult.  This cannot have been easy.

[andrewbowden]

I'm not that familiar with the layout of the whole school either but the ground floor plan suggests that there are many rooms that can be accessed from outside and could be isolated from the inside that could be less disruptive than losing the hall. I would like to see some evidence that this has been properly looked at with the objective of minimising disruption to the school.

The way the school works is that all the ground floor classrooms have exits out into the playground and exits onto the main corridor.  From the main corridor you can get anywhere in the school.

The other way into the main corridor is from the main reception.  To get into the school from reception, you have to sign in and the door connecting the office to the corridor is access controlled.

So to use a classroom for polling you either block all outdoor access and have voters accessing from the playground, or you have them coming in via main reception, and so you run the risk of anyone getting access to the whole of the school.

The reason they can normally use the hall for polling is because that has access from the car park.  They have doors that open onto the car park, and people can access that without going in the playground and without using main reception. 

I guess they could use the dining/small studio in the same way.  It could just be big enough and could be isolated.  But that has issues as there would be no way for the kitchen to get to serve food

The Parent Community room probably is too small but I also think (and I could be wrong) that it's used for pre and post school activities.  The only other room that's isolated is the heads office.

I have no special knowledge on these things other than that my son goes there and I have been in the building several times for various activities, events and parents evenings.  The school do take both safeguarding and attendance very seriously and I am sure if they have considered every option.  I think the school - like many - is in an impossible position here.  The fault clearly lies in the system which prioritises cheaper solutions like using schools, over the education of millions of children.

[admin]

I am guessing the issue with using a classroom is safeguarding.  They can isolate the hall from the pupils quite easily.  Classrooms wouldn't be easy to do so.  Maybe they could do the nursery area but have no idea if the layout of that room would work.

I'm not that familiar with the layout of the whole school either but the ground floor plan suggests that there are many rooms that can be accessed from outside and could be isolated from the inside that could be less disruptive than losing the hall. I would like to see some evidence that this has been properly looked at with the objective of minimising disruption to the school.


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[andrewbowden]

I am guessing the issue with using a classroom is safeguarding.  They can isolate the hall from the pupils quite easily.  Classrooms wouldn't be easy to do so.  Maybe they could do the nursery area but have no idea if the layout of that room would work.

[admin]

Good morning

I confess I don't know the criteria for deciding on polling stations, but I have asked SMBC on behalf of the Local Councillors, to give us an explanation of the decision making process and as soon as I have a response, I will share it. 

Thanks
Becky Senior

@Malcolm Allan
@TomDowseMarpleSouth
@ColinMac
@Steve Gribbon
@Aron Thornley

Thank you Becky, that will be helpful.

Below is a notice taken from the myschools web site that sheds some light on the process. It was for the referendum but the same basic rules must apply.

With regard to Rose Hill, it raises questions like:

• How has SMBC worked with the school to minimise disruption?
• Why can't a classroom be used instead of the hall - this would avoid the issues described by @andrewbowden
• What alternative options have been investigated?

EU Referendum - Information for Headteachers regarding the use of schools as a Polling Station

Please note that for this referendum the law will require that schools must be used as polling stations where they are selected by the Counting Officer. We appreciate that this is very short notice and that this may cause disruption. Where possible Electoral Services will seek to work with your school to try and minimise the disruption, but ultimately as your school has been deemed to be the most suitable venue then the school cannot refuse to allow its use.

Further Information on Use of Schools as Polling Stations

The Counting Officer is required to provide a polling station for voters in each of the authority’s polling districts. Whilst ideally the Council would have the choice of a range of fully accessible buildings, conveniently located for the electors in the area, this is not always the case and there are areas of the authority where schools are the only premises which can accommodate voting.

The law requires that schools must be used as polling stations where they are selected by the Counting Officer.

The counting officer may use, free of charge, for the purpose of taking the poll—

(a)   A room in a school maintained or assisted by a local authority or a room in a school in respect of which grants are made out of moneys provided by Parliament to the person or body of persons responsible for the management of the school.

(b)   A room the expense of maintaining which is met by any local authority.

This legislation also covers voluntary aided schools and Academies on the basis that they receive monies from Parliament.

Where possible the Counting Officer’s staff will seek to work with your school to try and minimise disruption, but ultimately if a certain school or room is deemed to be the most suitable venue then the school cannot refuse to allow it to be used.

If your school has been used before but you would like to change the room used or any other arrangement you should contact Electoral Services immediately.

Finally it is important that if the school premises are used for polling purposes there should be no obstruction to access to voting on the premises and to voters during the polling hours of 7.00 a.m. to 10.00 p.m.

Options for Schools

As you are aware the School Standards and Framework Act 1998 and the associated regulations (The Education (School Day and School Year (England) Regulations 1999 (No 3181)) requires that schools should meet for not less than 380 sessions (190 days) for pupils.

You should bear in mind that polling staff are not subject to DBS checks, previously CRB, and latest guidance states that they are not required to be so on the basis that they do not meet the regulated activity legislative eligibility requirement, as they only have the opportunity for contact with children on an ad hoc or irregular basis for short periods of time. It is for you as Headteacher to undertake a risk assessment and consider if there is a safeguarding issue.

While advising you of the statutory position it is recognised that closure disrupts education and also impacts on attendance levels. Schools required to close on polling day in the past have rescheduled an INSET day on the day of closure or have made up the lost day by other means, either at the beginning or end of a term. Examples of other arrangements to avoid closure include the following:

* using nurseries or children’s centres to ensure that the provision of statutory education is not interrupted;

* providing additional directional signage to ensure electors do not approach the school reception.
 

[Will L]

I don't know either way, but it's possible the Cricket Club already has regular bookings on Thursdays.  Or that no alternative venue has ever been sought because the school normally manages to stay open during elections.

As I noted below - this is a specific problem at Rose Hill caused by the time of year.  Normally they don't close for elections.

Function room is booked up for Quiz night on the thursdays at the Cricket Club.

[BeckySenior]

Good morning

I confess I don't know the criteria for deciding on polling stations, but I have asked SMBC on behalf of the Local Councillors, to give us an explanation of the decision making process and as soon as I have a response, I will share it. 

Thanks
Becky Senior

@Malcolm Allan
@TomDowseMarpleSouth
@ColinMac
@Steve Gribbon
@Aron Thornley

[amazon]

Depriving 550 kids of a day's education so that the election can take place seems quite disproportionate.

Why does it have to be at the school at all? Up here in Mellor we vote at the sports club and the school stays open. Marple Cricket Club is just over the road from Rose Hill - what's wrong with that?

Crazy closing a school that could mean parents losing a days work to look after there  children .